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At the moment the download at the top of this page is named "Application Source (7.0.8)", although it is 7.0.9 (I suppose ..)
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Fixed
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I would like to create the content in the wiki for how to do a translation, how to fix existing translations, how to contribute changes, etc. While I do have a linquistic background, I simply have not had time to look into how to do this technical process with ToDoList. I can't document it if I don't know how to do it.
If some of our friends here will provide some step by step instructions, I will follow them, learn how to add a language to the collection, and then document the process in the wiki. Whatever is posted here doesn't need to be formalized, formatted, etc. Just nudge me in the right direction. And please let me know about specific challenges, like decisions with grammar or context, issues with character sets (code page, UTF8/16, etc), or maybe dialect issues.
Since my other languages are already chosen, I was thinking about doing a translation for Klingon or l33T, but I'll probably do Esperanto.
Thanks!
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Hi Tony
some time ago I sent a simple TDL with keywords and a link to a screencast to Dan. Please reconcile with him if it can be used and/or he or I should send it to you.
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Thx Peter.
I think that Tony would find the screencast very helpful if you could forward it to him.
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Hi Tony
some months ago I made a screencast (long as usual ..):
http://autode.sk/1E2rAyu
User Michele Locati proposed to use the "Transifex" system for translation; there are some discussions (here?/Github?/Google Group?)
https://www.transifex.com/mlocati/todolist/[^]
And here is a TXT, exported from TDL, showing the keywords (based on the screencast):
1 Translation of TDL (Task ID: 1) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:39) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:54) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/4)
1.1 Basisc (Task ID: 2) (Parent Task ID: 1) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:39) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:40) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/1)
1.1.1 Environment (Task ID: 6) (Parent Task ID: 2) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:40) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/3)
1.1.1.1 TDL Software (Task ID: 7) (Parent Task ID: 6) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:41) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:43) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/2)
1.1.1.1.1 Feature Enable 'Add-to-Dictionary' (for translators) (Task ID: 8) (Parent Task ID: 7) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:41) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:42) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.1.1.1.2 Button "Clean Up" (Task ID: 9) (Parent Task ID: 7) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:42) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:42) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.1.1.2 Files (Task ID: 10) (Parent Task ID: 6) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:43) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/3)
1.1.1.2.1 Local storage / download / Github (Task ID: 13) (Parent Task ID: 10) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:43) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:44) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.1.1.2.2 Your language.csv (Task ID: 11) (Parent Task ID: 10) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:43) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:43) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.1.1.2.3 Mylanguage.csv (Task ID: 12) (Parent Task ID: 10) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:43) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:43) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.1.1.3 Editor (Task ID: 16) (Parent Task ID: 6) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/4)
1.1.1.3.1 No Excel, no Word (Task ID: 17) (Parent Task ID: 16) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.1.1.3.2 Better No Notepad (Task ID: 18) (Parent Task ID: 16) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.1.1.3.3 Fileformat UTF-8; CR/LF (Task ID: 19) (Parent Task ID: 16) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:45) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:46) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.1.1.3.4 Keep in mind: snchronous modification via the user and via TDL, depending on settings (Task ID: 20) (Parent Task ID: 16) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:46) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:54) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2 Translating (Task ID: 3) (Parent Task ID: 1) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:40) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:56) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/7)
1.2.1 Structure of file: header, columns, sections (Task ID: 21) (Parent Task ID: 3) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:46) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:47) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2.2 indented / repeated strings (Task ID: 22) (Parent Task ID: 3) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:47) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:51) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/3)
1.2.2.1 defined via indended strings (Task ID: 23) (Parent Task ID: 22) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:48) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:48) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2.2.2 usually don't translate (Task ID: 24) (Parent Task ID: 22) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:48) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:48) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2.2.3 but consider context: cases, articles, length of strings versus area in dialogue, ... (Task ID: 25) (Parent Task ID: 22) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:48) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:49) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2.3 consider ampersands & (Task ID: 27) (Parent Task ID: 3) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:50) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:51) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2.4 consider special characters and placeholder like %, \n, \t, brackets, file extensions ... (Task ID: 26) (Parent Task ID: 3) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:50) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:55) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2.5 take a look at the strings in "*removed.csv" to reuse strings which has been removed because of typos, new formatting ans do on (Task ID: 28) (Parent Task ID: 3) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:51) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:52) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2.6 consider the "standard-terminology", take alook at http://www.microsoft.com/Language/de-de/Search.aspx (Task ID: 29) (Parent Task ID: 3) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:53) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:53) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.2.7 also "translate" identic strings (HTML -> HTML) to remove it from section NEED_Translation (Task ID: 33) (Parent Task ID: 3) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:56) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:56) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.3 Checking (Task ID: 4) (Parent Task ID: 1) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:40) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:54) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/2)
1.3.1 check the results in context, formating, articles, terminology... (Task ID: 30) (Parent Task ID: 4) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:53) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:58) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.3.2 make a spell-check of your strings: take it via Excel, remove all special characters, start spell check (Task ID: 34) (Parent Task ID: 4) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:57) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:58) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.4 Publishing (Task ID: 5) (Parent Task ID: 1) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:40) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:54) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00) (: 0/2)
1.4.1 upload to github (Task ID: 31) (Parent Task ID: 5) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:54) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:54) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
1.4.2 send per mail to Dan (Task ID: 32) (Parent Task ID: 5) (Priority: 5) (Risk: 0) (Percent Complete: 0) (Creation Date: 03.08.2015 10:55) (Created By: Glasl) (Modified Date: 03.08.2015 10:55) (Start Date: 03.08.2015) (Cost: 0.00)
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Pierre - That is an Excellent video. Thank you Very much!
Unless there is another suggestion, I will write wiki material which follows the same order of content as the video so that people can follow along with both.
I have seen the notes from Michele here but I don't know how the content moves cleanly between the Transifex format and the TDL CSV. I know he wrote some code for this. If someone can explain (or refer me to info) how to use Transifex with this, then I can document that as an option as well. Do we run the CSV file through a conversion, do translation in Transifex, then convert back?
Does the process work to the satisfaction of all translators here? Also, what are the pros and cons of using either method? Are there any issues with the Transifex method that make it undesirable, or perhaps that Michele can fix?
As you can see, I don't know yet if that is becoming the new standard, if it's still in the acceptance phase, or if there is some debate about it's use.
Thanks again!
Danke!
Merci!
Arigatoo!
7[-]4|\|x!
谢谢 你 帮 我
qatlho'
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iamstarbuck wrote: That is an Excellent video. Thanks for the praise. (I hope it's not to much pain for an English adapted ear)
Transifex: I don't use it and I didn't test it, because German translation is up-to-date and for me it makes no sense to use a new system for only a few words. It seem to be a powerful tool, and if somebody wants to use it or to improve German, it's up to him. The integration / synchronization with TDL has to be tuned with Dan.
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Pierre de la Verre wrote: Transifex: I don't use it and I didn't test it, because German translation is up-to-date
Not 100% true: since YourLanguage.csv has been updated, German lacks at least one of the new translation strings: "Preference Files (*.ini)"
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Hi Tony
Please make no mention of Transifex in the wiki.
We have a process that works well and we do not need the additional complication.
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Hi!
Here's how the current Transifex process works:
1. People that wants to translate TDL with Transifex need to create a free Transifex account
2. Once you have a Transifex account, you can join an existing language group (or ask the creation of a new language) at https://www.transifex.com/mlocati/todolist/.
3. On a server of mine, an automated process fetches (once a day) the last English strings from GitHub and updates automatically my unofficial Transifex project.
So, ToDoList developers just need to keep the YourLanguage.csv updated, and every language will be automatically updated. Translators may also choose to be notified when new strings need to be translated.
4. Once translators are done with a language, they can drop me a line (via Transifex or to my email address mlocati@gmail.com): I'll create a new pull requests on GitHub, so that developers may review it and include the new translation file in the next TLD releases.
PS: to upload/download translations to/from Transifex I wrote a few scripts that can be found here.
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To Dan and Tony:
I suppose to add this way to the Wiki. It is an additional way to do the job - if a translator wants to use it, then it is up to him. It can simplify the translation while leaving the workflow for the developers unmodified. If a translator does not like it he can make it in the way he wants ....
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I follow whatever Dan wishes for the wiki and Social Ecosystem.
At this time, and always subject to discussion and change, the wiki is about the software itself, how it works, how people can use it, and the "official" mechanisms we have in place for user contributions.
Even if the wiki does not contain information about Transifex, translators are free to use whatever methods they feel is effective for themselves. So if a translator uses Transifex to become aware of changes and to submit contributions, that's their option.
I haven't discussed this with Dan but I personally believe there are a few issues at the moment which make this a situation that should be discussed, not now, but soon:
1) Free services are subject to come and go. It would be unfortunate if Transifex had a breakdown, went away, got acquired, or changed their business model. That kind of thing happens all the time. Such an event would interrupt the translation process for this software if everyone depended on it.
2) Not only is this process dependent on a third-party service but it's dependent on the functionality of software from yet another third-party. Sure, that contribution generously provided as Free and Open Source Software (FOSS) just like ToDoList, and anyone can host it, monitor it, contribute, etc. But this creates a dependency which Dan can't control. Think about your own ToDoList tasks, and how you'd feel if you had a task dependent on another task that you couldn't control. That fact should prompt you to increase the value of the Risk field for that task and related tasks.
3) At this time, the process relies on one individual as a central focus point to aggregate translations and update the GitHub repo. This reduces the "open" contributions from many people to one. If that one person is on vacation, disabled, disinterested, or otherwise distracted, a major release could be in a position of being published without translations which have already been contributed by the community.
I'm not saying any one of these points is critical. All of them can be reasonably argued as being minimal - I'd make those arguments myself to some degree. I'm just saying this specific process introduces at least three new potential points of failure, no matter how small. The current open translation process does not expose the software to so many third-party vulnerabilities.
Again, if we think about this in ToDoList terms, this specific "task" of adopting (implied by documenting) a new translation process, has a Risk of about 6 and therefore a Priority of something like 2. It's a low priority initiative because we don't need to make changes, especially with the elevated risk. But it's not off the list of things that I personally think should be considered.
And that's where I think we can leave Transifex and related procedures for now: As long as the translations are still being made and everyone knows how it works manually, then this specific feature of ToDoList and its users who depend on it are properly "insured". But with later discussion and consideration for minimizing risk, we can reconsider documenting the Transifex process in the wiki as an accepted alternative process.
I've been tempted to suggest that we copy the Transifex documentation into the wiki anyway with lots of disclaimers about how it's not yet a fully "supported" or accepted process. But that just creates confusion, more questions, etc. We just don't need that right now. If we don't include it for now then we don't need to explain (again) why it's not integral to how we do things (yet).
Remember - this is all just my own thoughts, not discussed with Dan. But this is how I would see all of this for my own software projects, and I personally get a little nervous introducing anything that I perceive as having elevated Risk.
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I totally agree.
Just some thoughts: the risk of using Transifex is very low.
First of all, it's a quite solid company, with big customers (see here and here), and it's up and running since 2008 (I think).
Furthermore, translations won't stay only in Transifex: when they are ready, they'll be included in the GitHub repository.
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Thanks for the support - even if we're not sure this is anything like what's on Dan's mind.
General thoughts here:
One of my personal quests with the wiki and my occasional Tips series in Google Plus[^] is to bring more info about project management and task management to ToDoList users. Many people are already project managers, looking for a tool to help with their job. Others are just looking for a better way to organize their lives. Without some info about How to use the tool in context, versus which buttons to press, we lose some of the benefits. It's strategic thinking versus tactical.
With that in mind, I see "Transifex on the wiki" as being a (tactical) task which is a sub-task of a higher level parent. It's dependent upon a discussion (maybe just in Dan's head) of (strategic) risk assessment. As we see here, I guess a Risk of 6 and Michele suggests it's more like 1. But for any task where we propose action there should be other tasks which support that action, like determination of validity, discussion while the task is in progess, testing, implementation, follow-up work which is often required to ensure the higher level task is truly "Complete".
So with this and other requests for "can we do 'this'?" or "why can't we do 'that'?" The answer is sometimes "sure, but there's a lot more involved". This is one of the challenges for all of us project managers (business owners, developers) where end-users wonder why a 5 minute change took a couple weeks to make. If we put our tasks into ToDoList we can show before work starts exactly how long it might take, and when it's done we can show exactly how we actually spent our time.
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Greetings,
In the last version 7.0.9, I can not retrieve the option Display Subtask completion in front of task's title (which was somewhere between Strike-through completed tasks and Show Parent tasks with a folder icon in previous releases according to the wiki).
I wonder if this option has been latterly discontinued or has been moved somewhere else in settings.
Thanks for your enlightenment...
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IMHO the solution (the setting) is not in the Preferences, it is in the display of attributes ("Subtasks"). Is this what you are looking for?
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GizMecano wrote: I wonder if this option has been latterly discontinued Unfortunately yes.
There were two main issues with it:
1. It required double-rendering which slowed the overall performance and caused problems with anti-aliased text
2. It interfered with the default tree functionality that allows you to type a letter to cycle through tasks having that as the first letter of the task title.
However, as Peter pointed out, this functionality is still provided via the dedicated 'Subtasks' column.
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Greetings,
I had actually found the column settled to display this information. Even if I must admit that I prefered a little bit the previous implementation, I understand the two problems mentioned above and I think that the attribute column would be sufficient for my use.
By the way, maybe it will be useful to consider updating the wiki on this point.
Thanks for your answers.
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GizMecano wrote: By the way, maybe it will be useful to consider updating the wiki on this point.
The Wiki has an extra sub-apge / side-page for suggestions. Please add your info there
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As Pierre suggested, please see the Suggestion Box link in my signature here for Wiki notes. Or see the Suggestion Box page in the wiki itself.
One thing I need to do with the wiki periodically is to note where things have changed and then go back and get new screenshots and change the text.
While the wiki is one of my high priorities, I haven't been posting many updates recently. But we'll see a lot of new content soon. I recently got a good off-line Markup editor so I can write wiki content anywhere now.
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Hello,
I'm having trouble drag and dropping items from outlook 2013 and opening them afterwards.
I have a message saying ToDoList was unable to install the 'outlook' protocol handler.
Even if I run ToDoList with an admin account.
Could you please help?
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Two questions:
a) Do you use the current version 7.0.9 (released today)? There are some mail-related fixes.
b) have you searched the forum for "outlook protocol handler". Some times ago there were some discussions about it ...
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Hi,
I'm using the version 7.0.9 released today but also tried it with an older version and it doesn't work.
It used to work before (probably when I had outlook 2010).
I opened it first as an admin then as a non admin, nothing works.
It drags the mail into TDL (I see the subjet and everything) but then I cannot open it from the tool.
I looked into the forums, nothing. I will look again
Thanks,
Imad
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If you drag&drop a mail to a folder (e.g. c:\test) and double-click on it - what happens?
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