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Nope, that's why we use TeamCity for building packages in a local network, mostly C# and C++ development.
There is a snag though, when I'm going to retire in a few years time it will be very difficult for my employer to find someone who can manage the builders and all the builder scripting I wrote.
That's what you get when you deviate from the Azure path (curse of the Azure Bonds) 
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Cp-Coder wrote: In view of the catastrophic global IT mess: Do you still trust the cloud?
I trust the technology, but I don't trust Google, Apple, etc. to not be politically biased or sneaky. So, yes and no. For instance, there have been reports that Apple keeps your photos even after you delete them. Google does the same with Gmail, btw. Tech companies have shown their true colors and it's pretty disgusting if you ask me.
As far as the tech side, there's nothing wrong with it. Outages suck, but as long as they don't lose your data it's no big deal. If it's sensitive then encrypt it so a data breach won't matter. People act like an outage is a huge deal, but a house fire could wipe you out too. So, do both if you're really that worried.
Jeremy Falcon
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I agree. The technology is mostly sound and reliable; people not so much.
"A little time, a little trouble, your better day"
Badfinger
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Jeremy Falcon wrote: a house fire could wipe you out
This is why I have two large external SSD's at home. One contains an image backup plus differentials, while the other is a robocopy mirror of my working data. Once a week these get swapped with an identical pair at work.
... and yes, I do take a look at the backups to make sure they're working properly.
Software Zen: delete this;
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Absolutely not.
Going back to pre cloud days (more on that in a second) say early 90s, the wife started a web site development business. At the time, none of our customers could afford their own server, and someone figured out how to create one server and sell multiple virtual servers hosted on it. Now, my wife was the html monkey while I handled the Perl and server errors, sql stuff.
The more I learned about virtual servers, the more I as adamant in that we were not going to save customer information for any customer. If a website wanted to handle CC transactions, we offboarded it to some other site that I cannot remember the name. Why?
1) Sure the info goes over https. Then it goes into a mysql database on a virtual server that I have no control over. If the server owner has a bad actor, all of the sites we support were wide open. Customers did not understand this.
2) Vulnerability. If someone takes the base server down, you're down. If they hack the base server, our customers are screwed. We actually had this happen. A hacker got into the hosting company, contaminated the OS and just waited. The hosting company never detected it and after 90 days, all of the backups were corrupt. Their only option was to format the hard drives. Keep a separate backup rule learned the hard way.
3) Although Microsoft (this post, I am not picking on them specifically) gushes about how protected the Azure servers are, they run on common hardware for multiple customers, and they have been caught more than once with improper security settings allowing one customer to see other customers' data. I have no idea about the Amazon and HP environments, but if I were paranoid....
What amazes me about corporations and governments doing this is that they think they are being responsible from having a legal service agreement. We promise, they promise, etc. This is what happens when management hides behind these legal agreements. You never, ever want to have to refer to the contract except for trivial things.
Cloudstrike and likely Microsoft are going to be writing a lot of checks over the next few months - if they survive. I just hope no one died.
YOU DO NOT DESIGN IN A SINGLE POINT OF FAILURE FOR MISSION CRITICAL SYSTEMS.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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charlieg wrote: Cloudstrike and likely Microsoft
[...]
charlieg wrote: if they survive
3 trillion dollars in market valuation (and only going down fractions of a percentage point since this started) says Microsoft will be okay.
I may agree with you about Cloudstrike however.
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yeah, did not make myself clear there. Cloudstrike is far more vulnerable. but this going to end up costing both billions.
Companies are just not putting up with this stuff. Experian settled out of court A LOT. It's the downside of collecting data in those cases.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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charlieg wrote: Companies are just not putting up with this stuff
I think they do. No matter how big the disaster, things aren't changing.
Why fine the responsible companies when said fine simply gets filed as an operating expense? You wanna get serious about it, threaten jail time for the execs--those who sign off on things--and I think you'll suddenly see the needle move.
One can only dream...
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not fine, sue.
About 10 years ago, somebody got hacked - Target for sure, but toss in Experion, etc. Home Depot, Lowes and a lot of banks went after them for damages.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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Right, but my point is, you sue a company, the company ends up paying a fine and moves on. Nothing changes.
If you start threatening to put C-level executives in jail, things would start changing overnight.
Extreme? Absolutely. But I don't see how things will ever improve otherwise.
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charlieg wrote: YOU DO NOT DESIGN IN A SINGLE POINT OF FAILURE FOR MISSION CRITICAL SYSTEMS.
I would consider that the first rule of Systems Engineering!
Will Rogers never met me.
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you would think that.
so many face palms. For those of our international community, the United States government by way of the FAA force airlines to cover passenger costs dues to travel disruptions. How this is on the airlines, only the government can come up with this. I happen to live in Atlanta where Delta Airlines is a "pillar" in the community. 80% of the flights out of the busiest airport in the world belong to Delta.
You think Delta is going to eat this? I think Cloudstrike just figured out they were mission critical. Oops. And the CEO will still get his bonus. If I were at cloudstrike, I'd be cashing in my stock options last week.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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Never have, never will. It's a mania.
The only one you can trust with your stuff is you. If you can't even trust yourself, why would you trust someone else?
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I totally get what you're saying, but some people really can't be trusted with their own data. The ones who don't think there's anything wrong with "password1", that is.
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the point here is that they own that. It's their data, and if they lose it, well that's on them.
Idiots have pushed so much out to the cloud - some near mission critical and possibly more. Remember, it was microsoft setting up azure servers with databases and the process did not include setting permissions or changing the default password.
Have you heard the story about McDonald's not changing the bluetooth passwords on their ordering machines and menus?
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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charlieg wrote: Have you heard the story about McDonald's not changing the bluetooth passwords on their ordering machines and menus?
I can't say that I have, but already it sounds fun...
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yeah, teens found about it, mayhem 
There is also the story of a professor doing a security project. We wondered about ATMs. Doing a quick google, he came across the operating manuals of several ATM makers that dominated the market. In the manual was the default maintenance password. Out he went, followed instructions, and he was in maintenance mode for 10 of 10 test atms. Reading further, he redefined the value of each bin of bills to $1. Whereupon he withdrew "$500" dollars - in 20s. He took the 10k into the branch and asked to see the manager....
About 2 days later, you could not find the manual online unless you knew where to look.
Charlie Gilley
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
Has never been more appropriate.
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charlieg wrote: About 2 days later, you could not find the manual online unless you knew where to look.
And probably they thought it was enough done to fix it.
M.D.V. 
If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about?
Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you
Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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“Where to look…”
The Internet Way Back Machine?
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charlieg wrote: He took the 10k into the branch and asked to see the manager....
...and I'm better he got himself in trouble for pointing out the flaw. Happens all the time. Happened to me when I was a kid in high school (although nothing as high-stake as this)
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Also reminds me of someone trying to remove some copyrighted material from a github repo… just go back in the history!
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Yes but it's their data we are not their mothers
In a closed society where everybody's guilty, the only crime is getting caught. In a world of thieves, the only final sin is stupidity. - Hunter S Thompson - RIP
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Sure.
And that's exactly how those big hosting companies get away with it, time and again. It's never their fault.
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Cp-Coder wrote: I will never get in a position where cloud failures can harm me.
If you have any amount of money in a bank, I'm afraid I have bad news for ya...
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